The Hobby Boards

auburn35 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2024 7:56 am Interesting listen.

I was disappointed Jeremy didn't fall back on his association with Tag for some of his questions, especially when asking about grading companies communication and Kurt saying before/after is one of the only detection methods.

Not surprising, but if accurate and psa actually cares, hearing that Kurt has no submission restrictions is just crazy.

mindcycle wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2024 1:47 pm

auburn35 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 15, 2024 7:56 am Interesting listen.

I was disappointed Jeremy didn't fall back on his association with Tag for some of his questions, especially when asking about grading companies communication and Kurt saying before/after is one of the only detection methods.

Not surprising, but if accurate and psa actually cares, hearing that Kurt has no submission restrictions is just crazy.

Jeremy might just have the most sponsors i've ever seen for a hobby content creator. He may not even know what title TAG gave him at this point..

I may be wrong but I thought I heard somewhere that Kurt was banned from grading with PSA?

siuwongkee wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 4:05 am I feel, this is not a good enough reply from PSA. So we know Kurt's cleaning is alteration, how do they avoid that? Like, we know lab diamond is very popular now, so when I send a diamond to GIA, I need to know it is natural but not lab grown. I send a watch to Rolex, I need to know it is Authentic. But again, like the PSA 10 Wemby black, they just keep on saying, we do not see signs. (So does that mean their equipment is not updated enough?)

This is the reason I no longer feel like collecting 90s cards, it is really a mess I do not want to be in. Grading companies have too much say on the condition of the cards that determined the price of the card but it is obvious, their equipment and method is still in the 90s.

AbraCalabro wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 9:12 pm

I understand where you're coming from. There are guys who are very popular now who ruined the whole hobby, all this stuff that is happening now is a result of their selfish and greedy efforts. (Example, I recall seeing photos of one of the Nubani brothers using Kunt's card care, when instead he should be denouncing it!) 90s cards can be dangerous to get into if you don't know what to look out for and even then, sometimes people can be fooled. (see attachment for an example of this, some one got ripped off for 360+ dollars!!!)

Other hobbies regulate themselves very well, but in cards, unfortunately there are so many stupid people and losers who are ready to worship other grown men. There are some people who deny that there is any bad stuff happening, but that's either because they're ignorant and wish to stay that way, OR it is because they're in on it themselves and stand to profit...or they are covering for their friends. A good number of them used to post on BO.

If this goes to CGC there is at least a 50% chance they will not catch the problem, because they are incompetent. I have had first hand experience with CGC's incompetence. Not from a purchase, but from a sale. (They thought a real card was not authentic.)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/375360705363

Screenshot 2024-04-20 at 23-07-24 Hakeem Olajuwon 1997-98 Flair Showcase Legacy Collection_100 SP HOF Rockets eBay.png

siuwongkee wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 10:05 pm
I mean tbh, I will not blame some collectors manipulate the market and do things like they keep showing cards that they do not own. (1 of my friends told me this, I can neither confirm or deny this, he just said, some of the "collectors" are not "collecors", and not every card they showed, are theirs) I think this is just human nature, like nowadays, One Piece TCG is booming like sports cards during covid. (But unlike sports cards, Bandi has been doing a good job that makes them, sellers and players all feel ok) Some retailers are trying to manipulate the market and they still preach about the importance of grading. (Which if you know me a bit, I loath so much.) And of cos they will promote how they can help you clean the card. (Using wax or how the hell can they fix the dots on the cards) I am really ok with that.

As for 90s cards, I mean I have myself to blame also. I am not loaded enought to only collect the best 5 sets from the 90s and basically the most collected other than MJ, Kobe, Shaq and Rodman, so competition of cos is furious. It is like I love the new Rolex Daytona but my account is not big enough to let the retailer gives me at list price.

But even so, unless I am completely irrational, I still cannot accept the fact that, let's say the raw card of a 1998 Penny PMG is 6k. (Just estimate, let's further this assuming the card has not bee appeared for 5 years) There is a PSA 9 pop 1 on the market, then not only Penny collectors are eyeing this, some set collectors whom want the highest graded copy also want this. But you know this is at best a PSA 7 (arround 7.5-8k) because it is an early graded copy from PSA. So the question, are you paying the premium of PSA 9 for a card you know is PSA 7 but most people are buying the grade? (Can go as high as 12-15k, so you have to pay 4-5k more for a grade not deserve?)

So I suppose this is where I think I should stop.

AbraCalabro wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 11:45 am
You do realize though, the stuff in your first paragraph has a lot to do with the reasoning that exists in your last paragraph and your decision to stop?

mindcycle wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 4:50 pm You know I wouldn't normally knowingly subject you all to a Geoff Wilson video , however, he did recently interview Ryan Hoge and it appears they are working on detection methods for cleaned cards.

Using the following link you can skip right to the part about cleaning: https://youtu.be/8bfuICkhi4s?si=3At2ANQ7X3eUaDhd&t=2312

Regarding detection methods, I was pointed to the following CGC article by a guy over on IG. https://www.cgccards.com/news/article/1 ... charizard/

It talks about a rare Charizard card they recently graded, but the more interesting part is found if you scroll down to the "Analysis of the card" section. They go over various tests they conducted to determine if the card was legit or not. They used an XRF spectrometer to determine different chemical elements on the card. The guy I was talking to about this told me these types of devices can be purchased in handheld form.

So given CGC has the technology to detect all chemicals present in a Pokemon card using a scanner, I feel like it wouldn't all that hard to get that setup at PSA. Sure, there will be a cost involved, but given they could potentially be on the hook for thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars when they grade altered cards it seems like a decent investment to make.

AbraCalabro wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 10:38 am I don't have much faith in CGC to be honest. Had an awful experience with them. If they're unable to tell that a non counterfeited set is real, then their efforts in anything else don't hold much promise.

mindcycle wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 6:36 pm

AbraCalabro wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 10:38 am I don't have much faith in CGC to be honest. Had an awful experience with them. If they're unable to tell that a non counterfeited set is real, then their efforts in anything else don't hold much promise.

Which cards did you send in?